The Torah speaks in human language’: A conversation with Avivah Gottlieb Zornberg
by Sarah F. Gold -- Publishers Weekly, 3/23/2009 12:10:00 PM
In Murmuring Deep: Reflections on the Biblical Unconscious (Schocken, March 31), her third book of biblical criticism, independent scholar Avivah Gottlieb Zornberg continues using her unique blend of midrash commentary, kabbalah, Hasidic commentary and psychoanalysis to plumb the depths of the Bible, its characters—and God Himself.RBL: How would you sum up the essence of your new book?
A: I’m interested in the nature of communication between people, between people and God and internally, intersubjectively. I take 12 different narratives from the Tanakh, and in each one I’m interested in the unconscious elements of communication, what is going on under the surface.
RBL: You place the midrash on the same level as the biblical text. You say, for instance, that the midrashic account of Abraham being thrown in a fiery furnace is “repressed” in the Bible.
A: From a postmodern reading, all texts are contemporaneous. The modern reader is faced with an array of texts, and if a commentary seems organically to have something essential to say about the original text, then it can be extrapolated backwards.
RBL: You write that your subject is really the “rabbinic unconscious.” What do you mean by that?
A: On the one hand, the rabbis understood the mystery of life. The other sense is that the rabbis themselves are conflicted. Just the fact that they say so many things and move so smoothly from one opinion to another opinion—I see that as not just horizontal—here’s one and here’s another. There’s a vertical sense of moving down into the depths.
RBL: You also broach the idea of God having an unconscious. What does that mean?
A: The rabbis are mediating a living relationship, and as such, there will be a sense that—like a human being—God doesn’t understand everything about Himself at a certain moment. Now, I know that’s the most challenging thing I say. But as soon as you enter into some kind of real relationship with God, it means a way of imagining him: He’s got a tone of voice, He’s got conflicts. That the Torah speaks in human language is a classic idea, and I take it very seriously.
Author photo © Debbi Cooper
